THE INSPIRATION PLACE PODCAST
Miriam Schulman:
Hello, passion maker. This is Miriam Schulman, and you’re listening to episode 156 Of the Inspiration Place Podcast. I am so grateful that you’re here. Today we’re talking all about becoming your own boss. Today’s guest is the owner and chief creative officer of Number 4 Design Studio. After many years as a creative leader in major corporations, including Hallmark and West Elm, she offers consulting services for businesses that want to reshape and build better work cultures and create inspiring employee experiences by re-imagining how their work environments look and feel resulting in transforming their practices, celebrations, creativity, and innovation. Make, Inspire, Share is not just a tagline, it’s a way of life. Please welcome to the Inspiration Place, Dayle Bennett. Well, hello, Dayle, welcome to the show.
Dayle Bennett:
Hello and thank you for having me.
Miriam Schulman:
I’m so excited to meet you.
Dayle Bennett:
Thank you so much for reaching out. This pandemic has made everything weird. I’m not going to lie. So sometimes you get lot of spam. I just remember seeing this and I was like, “Ooh, this is cool. Yeah.” I went on your podcast, I’m like, “Yes, I’m all about it.”, so-
Miriam Schulman:
Oh good, I’m so glad. I’m glad your excited to-
Dayle Bennett:
[crosstalk 00:02:21] Yes! Well at my part-time job, I worked for this place called the [The Lola 00:02:25]. It’s a coworking space and community for female entrepreneurs. They were like, “Ooh, that sounds cool.” So I sent them the link to your podcast and your website and they were like, “Ooh.” They’re the best I’m telling you. So I think what you’re doing is great too and thank you for doing what you do. Because I’m going to tell you, there’s not that many quality creative podcasts out there. This is definitely one that I love.
Miriam Schulman:
Oh, thank you so much.
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah. Yeah. This is great.
Miriam Schulman:
Thank you. I appreciate that. Well, I listened to you on one show and I just felt it didn’t you justice. It’s like, “Oh, there’s so much more to this Dayle than what we’re hearing here.” Like when I was researching, I was like, “And I really wanted to show the world who you are.”
Dayle Bennett:
I appreciate it so much. I hope that even this interchange helps me understand what I needed to be doing more. I did get the word out, so people understand who I am, what I’m doing, and the kind of company that I keep. Hello, you’re amazing.
Miriam Schulman:
[crosstalk 00:03:25] So I grew up many years in Atlanta. I spent a good portion of my childhood there. Anyone who’s from Atlanta, I’m always like, “Oh, there’s a little bit there.” So you’ve lived there now, I know you didn’t always live there. Is that right?
Dayle Bennett:
Yes. I’m actually from the city of Baltimore, but Atlanta is definitely my favorite second home. I’ve lived here twice. So this shows you how much I really love it. It’s amazing, it’s a great city to live in.
Miriam Schulman:
I do have family in Atlanta, so if we do visit, I’d love to look you up when we come.
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah, I’m right downtown. Come on over.
Miriam Schulman:
Oh you’re downtown? Awesome.
Dayle Bennett:
Oh yeah.
Miriam Schulman:
Okay. All right. So let’s talk about design trends. One of my favorite design trends that I’ve been following for quite some time is the color of the year.
Dayle Bennett:
Yes!
Miriam Schulman:
All right. Now I think it is either yellow and gray, or I’m behind a year. So what is it this year?
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah, yeah. No know you got it right. You got right. Pantone is the color Bible of trends and everyone, everyone uses it one way or the other to make their colors for whatever product or service they have going on. I’m obsessed with it. Obsessed.
Miriam Schulman:
It’s really interesting because when I first started hearing about the color trends, I thought that they were forecasting what was going to be popular. But really when you find out what Pantone does is they actually are seeing what’s already trending and like starting to pick up momentum. So it’s less about having a crystal ball and saying, suddenly people are going to start liking this color, and it’s more like this is already happening and there’s going to be a ground swell and you better get on this train.
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah. It’s a little bit of both actually, because they do forecast in the future. But they also, I feel like Pantone has really gotten with the program of every industry is not forecasting that far ahead. Some industries are in the now. Just like fashion, fashion does it kind of like a season or a year in advance. But because of the pandemic, they’ve had to take a different spin on how they are dealing with color, because color now it has to do with the way we live, the way we work, and the way that we see the earth, basically. So a lot of things that are happening politically in the news actually influences the way they choose colors now. If there’s like something global going on, everything is about recyclable things in reusable things. Now that’s starting to play a part in when it comes to picking out colors. The other thing that they’re doing is… and this is why they have two colors this time, they’re really thinking about how people feel, how they feel about color. That’s a huge change for them, which I love.
Miriam Schulman:
So tell us about why they picked the… And by yellow and gray, I want you to imagine… so you being that listener. I know Dayle knows, but it’s more like a sunflower yellow.
Dayle Bennett:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Miriam Schulman:
Then if you think about basically every living room I’ve been in, in Scarsdale lit that is now painted gray with a gray couch. So it’s like, those are the two colors, sunflower yellow… You don’t have to go into a living room in Scarsdale, You see it on TV. Like every fake family is in a gray room. Have you noticed that?
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah.
Miriam Schulman:
Right.
Dayle Bennett:
Oh, that’s funny. Those are the two colors behind me. You can see me, but they can’t. It is actually like the way light radiates to you and the shadow that it projects. That’s basically what those two colors are doing. That’s what I mean about the way you feel about color and not necessarily the way you see color, but kind of combining the two. It’s more about behavioral type things and less about you wear a yellow, but we sit on gray-
Miriam Schulman:
Okay, it’s more like sunshine and shadow?
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah.
Miriam Schulman:
Oh!
Dayle Bennett:
Like so different companies though, but different companies interpret that those two colors and the way that you might see it. So that’s why you might see a retailer do all these shades of gray, or why they might have gray pillows, or why they decide to do these different shades of sofas that are in gray but then they have all yellow pillows on top of the actual sofa. Some people are super literal. I mean, you also see it in automotive things, kitchens. I mean, any industry you can think of use the Pantone color system and it’s not just those two colors, it’s the two colors. Then they have color families. What works with them, like different hues and things, everyone takes that and runs with it. So you might have someone who do like a neon yellow with a really purple-ish gray or whatever. Whatever they feel like it’s going to work for their type of clientele, that’s how they interpret those colors.
Miriam Schulman:
I love Pantone so much. I didn’t do it this year, but in years past I would print out… And they do it in the fall and they also do it in the spring. You get the forecast, like what? Six months in advance of the season? So as soon as the fashion have their runway shows, so in the fall, they’re actually showing the… Wait, am I doing this right? It’s the spring collection they show in the fall?
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah.
Miriam Schulman:
Yeah.
Dayle Bennett:
So in the fall they show the spring collection and they also shows cruise, which is like leisure luxury ware.
Miriam Schulman:
So I would print it out on my six color printer, so it was on really good paper, so it accurate colors. Then I would go to Michael’s and I would match up colors in the acrylic paint aisle that would most closely match the Pantone colors and see what I could create with it.
Dayle Bennett:
Oh yeah?
Miriam Schulman:
I used to have fun doing that. Yeah.
Dayle Bennett:
Although that’s a thing, every industry make sure that those colors match the Pantone colors. So it’s no coincidence that you went to Michael’s and you could find those colors in pens, markers, paint, stickers, they all use it.
Miriam Schulman:
Oh yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It’s a lot of fun. Washi tape, everything.
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah. Sticky notes, all that stuff.
Miriam Schulman:
Yeah. I love not only just doing the color trends, but then also combining it with looking at what’s trending at places like Surtex and seeing what kind of imagery is trending. I remember when a friend of mine told me… this was a couple of years ago, “Oh, Llama’s are really hot.” I was like, “What?”
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah.
Miriam Schulman:
Then everywhere I looked there were llamas on the tumblers, on the mugs, on the Christmas cards, wearing Santa hats. There were llamas everywhere.
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah. And Sloths and all that.
Miriam Schulman:
Yeah, and sloths [crosstalk 00:10:10]. Like why? This animal we never even knew what it was, it’s literally everywhere.
Dayle Bennett:
You’re right? I don’t know how character trends start. I have no idea. Like you said, I love… like when you talk about Surtex, like to me, Pantone and color forecasting, Surtex is where it all comes to life.
Miriam Schulman:
Yeah. So since I’m a podcaster and previously, I used to write for professional artists magazine, I had press credentials. So I was able to walk the show without having to participate, I could go and see all the trends. So that was super fun because it’s in New York where I am.
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah.
Miriam Schulman:
I’ve always wanted to go to the Atlanta Gift Mart, I’m assuming you’ve been there?
Dayle Bennett:
Oh yeah.
Miriam Schulman:
Okay.
Dayle Bennett:
Oh yeah.
Miriam Schulman:
Tell me about what that kind of Santa land is like?
Dayle Bennett:
Oh my God. First of all, it’s three buildings. Each building has at least 12 floors. I used to actually design some showrooms at the Mart. The winter show, which is in January used to be the biggest show. But now their July show is just as nice. They have all kinds of stuff going on and it is sensory overload. Even I am like, “Ooh, I need to sit down. There’s too much stimulus going on.” It’s just so much stuff.
Miriam Schulman:
Well, that’s what I’m thinking. It’s like Willy Wonka, but for… Right. But for art and design-
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah.
Miriam Schulman:
Did they have it this year? 2021? Did it happen this July?
Dayle Bennett:
July, they did. It was in person they had all these… because each state is different about the restrictions and stuff. You go to the showrooms, they actually have little events that are happening during that whole week. So it was a lot of stuff. Even with that, they have trendsetters who of walk around and give people what the trends are that they see in the showrooms, so trend spotting is really important during that time as well.
Miriam Schulman:
That leads me to my next question. How do trends inspire your work?
Dayle Bennett:
I am one of those people who anything inspires me to be honest. I walk around, I see something, I write notes. I never really use trends until I actually went to grad school and they showed us how trends worked in the industry that we were aspiring to work in. Then I understood like where this stuff is coming from. It just only made finding inspiration even better. Flat Lays has been new trend, spotting situation. Pinterest, I mean endless turning of photos and the way people put things together. I love it. It really has helped me not only pick out my own favorite color palettes, but also helping other people when I am doing workshops, the way I set up things, the way I dress. So it’s really just all parts of my life from the time I wake up to the time I go to sleep.
Miriam Schulman:
By the way, I wanted to be sure you knew that I am taking applications for the Artist Incubator Mastermind. If you’re struggling to master the art of sales and marketing, because you’re lacking a solid strategy or a confident mindset, let’s fix that. To see if you qualify, go to schulmanart.com/biz. As in B-I-Z to apply. Now back to the show.
I really am curious about your work as a consultant inside companies. I don’t know if you have NDAs, but if you can give an example of work that you’ve done, either using the name of the company or just make an anonymous case study, I would love to hear an example of what you do.
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah. So I won’t use any company names, but work is pretty much the same. The thing that I have experienced, how I feel when I’m at work. The things that charge me and made me feel good, and the things that made me feel like, “Why am I even here?” I realized that a lot of people were going through that. I think I was super sensitive to it because I am a creative, the relationships they have with their employees, the relationships they have with one another, and then I’m also looking at your space. Because sometimes people will tell me, “Oh, I don’t really know what’s going on, my people are happy here.” They’re working in a dungeon. I’m like, there is no way that these people are saying that this is awesome. I actually want to get out of here because it’s scaryville.
So I started asking people what they really thought about their work. I started putting two and two together and decided this actually something that I want to doing at every job that I ever worked with. I’m the person who helped rewrite routines. I’m the person who helped gather folks did celebrations, did outings, all that kind of stuff. I realized that every company doesn’t have that, but if they are focused on making sure their employees are happy, then they get the results that they want from their business and people are not just peacing out. Because this new generation, they don’t care about loyalty and staying someplace for five years, they think it’s ridiculous. Five years to them is like a lifetime.
They like, “Wait, what? You wasted five years there?” I’m like, wait, “What? No, that’s not how it works.” But they expect basically how they work from home now to be able to sit on their sofa, tap on their computer but then they also want to… Not necessarily, I won’t say entertain, but they want their employees that care about them and how they feel. Everybody wants to feel that way, so that’s what I do. People invite me to come in and whether I’m working with the leaders or if I’m working with the whole team, I kind of give them a pathway to how to combat this. Sometimes it’s the basic things that has to happen. It’s like a creative manifesto, which no one seems to have one.
Miriam Schulman:
How do these oblivious bosses though know to bring you in? Like, that’s what I still can’t wrap my head around. Like, is it because they suddenly realized they have a problem with attrition? Like people are quitting?
Dayle Bennett:
So it is word of mouth, but usually it’s a mole that’s inside their own organization saying, “I need you to help us. This is what’s going on.”
Miriam Schulman:
That’s so funny.
Dayle Bennett:
It’s so funny but it’s always like that. I’ll have someone saying, “Oh my God yeah, this is what they decided to do for the celebration of my birthday or the month’s first day.” It’s like some really nasty cake and some like use candles. I’m like, “Hmm, help us.” Whatever the situation is I have the problem is there’s usually someone in the company “We need help.” I just tell people, “You just need to make over your work culture.” Because work cultures are terrible right now and been terrible for a long time. I’m just trying to position myself as I’m the girl who has the answer, who can walk you through this, no matter how bad the problem is, no matter how deep it is, no matter how dark it is, I can help you through it through a creative lens though.
Miriam Schulman:
What I keep thinking is, I don’t know if you watch the show, The Office? But-
Dayle Bennett:
Yes.
Miriam Schulman:
Okay.
Dayle Bennett:
I live that.
Miriam Schulman:
Right. So basically there was an episode where Jim he’s co-running the office with Michael. He decides everybody gets their own birthday party is ridiculous. There’s going to be just one birthday party for everybody. It did not go over well-
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah.
Miriam Schulman:
… trying to decide a cake that pleased everybody, like no.
Dayle Bennett:
That show has exposed so many dysfunctional work cultures. When that show was really hot, I actually was working at Hallmark. We would look at each other like, our boss name is Mike. It was like some serious issues. It’s even worse when the company is bigger, because sometimes they’re little micro groups that they’re having these problems, the upper management oblivious to what’s going on. You can have a really bad work culture and people still produce. But that doesn’t mean that it’s a good work culture. I always feel like creativity it’s the gate made to let people let their hair down and let the toes be exposed, so they can like add to the experience of the work that they do. A lot of people are just told “This is your task and you have to do the task.” That’s not necessarily how creativity works. Creativity pretty says, “Hey task, let me see some different ways I can approach this thing to get to the finish line.” Everybody wants that. I don’t know anyone says, “No, I don’t want to inject creativity.” Who says that? No one.
Miriam Schulman:
So that leads us to our final question, because you have been in many situations like the fictional office, whether it was West Elm, Hallmark, or one of the other corporations you’ve worked on or nonprofits or something like that. So you’ve been on the other side and now you’re helping transform the workplace. But what I really want to hear is what led you to decide to become your own boss?
Dayle Bennett:
Yeah. It’s always a personal journey, right? I think, I just feel like I’ve done all I can do on the inside. I’ve always been an in-house worker. I’ve always worked for someone else under their constraints, even though, even at my last job, I was at the top of the top. I felt like there was just something in me that was saying, “Dayle, you can do more and help more people and you should.” I had that conversation with myself probably three and a half years ago. It was just a series of things that were going on professionally and personally. I just needed basically to force myself in a sabbatical situation, where I just let everything go and just… I didn’t feel like I was being creative anymore.
I can’t live without creativity. I was born this way. Not being creative, I was depressed. I had nothing else to give. I didn’t have an opinion about anything. It started bringing out other things in me that weren’t normal. I didn’t want to live like that. I wanted to stop, pause, get inspired, get my mojo going, and rethink about how I want to use my energy every single day. I knew that I was going to be coming up to a milestone in my life, turning 50. I’m like, “What do I want the other half of my, my life to look like?” I don’t want to look out that window at work and say, “I wish I was doing that because that’s something I about. Or I wish I was doing that, or I wish I was influencing this group.” So it was really just a life choice. I was like, “I really want to do something that’s going to be more impactful but on my terms.”
Miriam Schulman:
That’s beautiful. So now that you’re in your fifties, that milestones in the rear view mirror… For me, it is as well, just so you know.
Dayle Bennett:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Miriam Schulman:
I felt when I turned 50 that I was just getting started.
Dayle Bennett:
Oh yeah. I’m like, “Where have I been?” I feel like when you’re so drowning in obligations, instead of your life’s work… And I think that’s the difference, right? I felt like my previous life was obligations and tasks. I feel like my new life is my life work, which I think is way more important and way more exciting. I can just feel the change. I felt the same way when I was turning 40. I just felt like my life was different, I was seeing things differently and some things I just didn’t give a crap about. I was just like, “I just don’t care about that anymore.” I just, don’t.
There’s just so many more things that I feel like if I’m doing my life’s work, I feel like I will experience things in a different way that’s way more fulfilling. I’ve already seen a change. I’ve already seen the way people treat me differently. I feel like it’s, my aura has… I always had a bright aura, but I feel like my aura now is a lot brighter, it’s friendlier and people just want to be in my presence and I want to be in theirs. So I don’t want to lose that feeling.
Miriam Schulman:
Well that’s 100% true. I mean, that’s why I wanted you on the podcast.
Dayle Bennett:
Aw!
Miriam Schulman:
I was like, “I want to get to know this person.” There’s something really special about what it is that you’re bringing to the world and the way you’re showing up in the world is like an example for many women. I know this is an audio show, but you guys have to go to her website to see the way she presents herself. I mean, she dresses creatively. You can tell everything you’re doing is completely with joy.
Dayle Bennett:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Miriam Schulman:
I don’t know if that’s the word you would use to describe-
Dayle Bennett:
Oh totally, totally. Joy? Yes.
Miriam Schulman:
You’re living your joy completely head to toe inside, outside everything that you’re doing. So thank you so much for honoring us today and coming on the show, I want people to go to your website, Dayle. So for my listeners, that’s number4designstudio.com Or on Instagram it’s design studio 4, on Instagram?
Dayle Bennett:
Designstudio.no4.
Miriam Schulman:
Designstudio.no4. We’ve included links to all those places in the show notes. So you can just click on them, schulmanart.com/156. Don’t forget if you liked this episode, you have to check out the Artist Incubator Mastermind. It’s my private coaching program for artists who are disappointed with their art sales and looking to master the art of sales and marketing. The Mastermind track is by application only to see if you qualify, go to schulmanart.com/biz. That biz as in the letter B-I-Z. Alrighty, Dayle, do you have any last words for my listeners before we call this podcast complete?
Dayle Bennett:
Creativity is it all of us and we all should tap into it.
Miriam Schulman:
Mic drop. Okay. Thank you. Next week we have on the one and only Jean Oliver. Trust me. You’re not going to want to miss it. So make sure you hit the follow button in your podcast app. If you liked today’s show, please leave me a review because it’s truly the best way to help other creatives find the show. By the way, if you pop your Instagram handle at the end of the review, I’ll even give you a shout out over on my IG stories. Okay, my friend, thank you so much for being with me here today. I’ll see you at the same time, same place next week. Stay inspired.
Thank you for listening to the Inspiration Place podcast. Connect with us on Facebook, facebook.com/schulmanart. Of course on schulmanart.com.
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