TRANSCRIPT: Ep. 250 Why Selling in Person Makes a Difference with David Meltzer


David Meltzer: You have to practice asking what people are doing day to day, pertaining to what you want to, hopefully, share with someone and find out two things, what they like and what they don’t like. Because if you know someone or you yourself, can help either give them more of what they like or take away some of what they don’t like you now have a quantitative value but it doesn’t happen sitting on your mom’s couch. High, broke, and sick dreaming about what you want.

Speaker 2: It’s the Inspiration Place podcast with artist Miriam Shulman. Welcome to the Inspiration Place Podcast, an Art World Insider podcast for artists by an artist where each week we go behind the scenes to uncover the perspiration and inspiration behind the art. And now your host, Miriam Schulman.

Miriam Schulman: Well, hello Artpreneur! This is Miriam Schulman, your curator of inspiration and you’re listening to episode number 250 of The Inspiration Place podcast. Today, we’re talking all about why selling in person makes a difference. And I’m going to bring on a guest to help me in just a moment. But, before we get there, I just want to talk a little bit about what inspired this episode. So I speak to many, many artists, I talk to people inside my incubator program, I’ve been talking to others during some of the free calls that happen as part of the Artpreneur bonuses or doing boot camps or master classes or inside of my Instagram, and many other ways. But the number one thing that seems to come up over and over again. Is this reluctance to sell and the reluctance to sell shows up in two ways.

First of all, it shows up on people’s websites. So the last time I did a website review which is a bonus that you get when you join the artist incubator program. I will go through your website. I check out all the main pages, your about page, your listing pages, your home page and I’ll tell you what you need to fix and change to make it get you more sales. But what happened in this last batch of websites that I reviewed. I think out of six of them, maybe only one artist had a way for people to actually buy the art. Almost every single one said, contact me if you want to buy this, and that you just cannot make your customers beg you to buy something. It’s hard enough to sell art, make it easy for them, make it delightful for them. And I think one or two people who actually have is “Buy” buttons. It was really challenging to figure out how to do it. I had to click here, to click there, to click someplace else for this hidden little tax that says “This is where you can buy my art” and I click someplace else and then it opened up a different screen. Listen, you need e-commerce. It’s not that hard. Get either Shopify or Squarespace and put it on your website. That’s it, you don’t need a fancy—you don’t need anything else. You don’t need anything else.

I don’t want to bad-mouth the other—–anything else stuff because they’ll come after me. I don’t want anyone else suing me. I recommend Squarespace or Shopify or heck even Etsy if you don’t have time or the wherewithal to make your own website. Etsy also works so make it easy to buy from you. The other place that I’m seeing a lot of resistance is people who do not want to sell in person, and these are the same people with those websites that don’t convert. So, if you wanna sell in person that’s great, but please, please, please get out of the research mode. You do not have to check out every venue before you go and deem it worthy for as a place to sell. You can sell to anyone as long as there are human beings there. That was something that was really funny during my book, signing party. So before it started, my book signing party started 6:30. And I got there early, I got there at six. One or two people wandered it. I sold books to both of them and I was joking with my husband how this is exactly what I do when I was at art fairs. Like even if there’s an art show where there’s not many people, I would still make sales because why? Social skills. I would say, “Hey, hi. I’m Miriam Schulman. I’m the artist. What brought you in today?” And have a conversation with them. You’d be surprised how many times that leads to a sale

But selling in person really really, really does make a difference because and it’s not just about the sales you make. That is something I hear from other artists, so I tried that, but barely broke even. But the point of having an art show in person isn’t just to make sales on that day. It’s also to collect email addresses. It’s also to find out what’s resonating with people, how people are responding to your artwork, all of those things. Okay. So I’m going to climb off my spot soapbox. And now I’m going to introduce our guest today.

He’s a legendary sports executive entrepreneur and investor. He co-founded Sports One marketing and formerly served as CEO of the renowned Leigh Steinberg sports and entertainment agency which was the inspiration for that movie, Jerry Maguire. The one with Tom Cruise’s “and you complete me.” Haven’t seen it? Go rent it on Netflix. It’s amazing. All right, please welcome to the Inspiration Place David Meltzer. Well hey there David welcome to the show.

David Meltzer: Hey there, thanks for having me. No, better place to be than an inspiring platform to help other people be inspired

Miriam Schulman: So I noticed from reading your bio that we’re both part of the triple high club. Do you know what that is?

David Meltzer: The triple chai club? I do not know, but I’m very curious.

Miriam Schulman: Okay, well, you know what chai is, right?

David Meltzer: Oh, yes, I know what chai is.

Miriam Schulman: How old are you?

David Meltzer: Oh, there you go. I’m 54. They’re triple chai. You nailed it. I should have been on that realm. Except I’m only in the triple high club for another month, though, so.

Miriam Schulman: Oh you are? You’re about to leave us. I’m actually entering it. Well, I will be in the future. When people are listening to this, I will be in the triple high club.

David Meltzer: Oh, when’s your birthday?

Miriam Schulman: My birthday is Saturday.

David Meltzer: Oh, happy birthday.

Miriam Schulman: Yeah. So for those people who have no idea what we’re talking about, and I’m sure there’s a lot out there, the Hebrew were chai—-Well, 18 in Hebrew is the word chai, which also means luck. And good things come in threes and three times 18 is 54. So I think this is going to be an amazing year for me. I hope this was an amazing year for you, David.

David Meltzer: It was the best year yet and I’m now entering what I call the Junior Seau year, which is his football number, my favorite football player from San Diego, 55. So I’m expecting even a better year than the triple high.

Miriam Schulman: So like, numbers are important. All right. So I got a hold of your book Connected to Greatness. And there was one thing that you were talking about that I think the people listening would be really interested in. So I’m always getting asked, where do I find art collectors? And you actually said pretty much the same thing that I’m always telling them, which is you go out into the world. So there was something you said that was very interesting, how you make more sales just by leaving your house than you do in your office. Something to that effect. Do you want to elaborate on that?

David Meltzer: Yeah, well, look, there’s four ways that we can create things. Those coincidences that you were talking about and it’s in person, on the phone, via email, or media, and those are the four ways to do it. And you need to practice doing it and you have to practice asking what people are doing day to day pertaining to what you want to hopefully share with someone and find out two things what they like and what they don’t like. Because if you know someone or you yourself can help, either give them more of what they like or take away some of what they don’t like. You now have a quantitative value, but it doesn’t happen sitting on your mom’s couch. High, broke and sick dreaming about what you want. Manifestation is a culmination of many laws, the law of gravity that says I’m exactly where I’m supposed to be at the right place at the perfect time. And two, the law of GOYA, Get off your ass, GOYA. And so many people think all the law of attraction is is sitting and dreaming about you what you want. But it isn’t. There’s the law of love, the law of allowance, the law of attraction, the law of GOYA, the law of gravity. So get off your ass and put attention and intention, what you do, say, think, believe and feel in a trajectory of what you want. And you’ll find that acceleration in the coinciding of the universe. The coincidences will be abundant and exponential in your life.

Miriam Schulman: I love that because I say the same exact thing just in different words.

David Meltzer: Even much, probably much more eloquent.

Miriam Schulman: And I use the word ass. So in my book Artpreneur, I get your introverted ass out of the house.

David Meltzer: Nice. I love it.

Miriam Schulman: Because I find like, no matter how much marketing I do, the people who are most likely—-So I help mostly artists, and many of them are visual artists. Although we do have a lot of listeners who have different creative businesses or just make money from their creative ideas, but specifically the visual artist who I’m speaking to when I was was primarily selling my art. I found that most of my art sales at these art shows happened because of the people I invited the week of the art show. Like, no matter how much marketing I did and how extensive my campaigns were, it was those postcards that I kept in my bag and handed it out at yoga class or the people I. Up to it pickup because when when you are selling art or selling anything, that is your art. We talked about this on your live stream. What is art? It’s whatever it is that you make it to be, whatever it is you’re creating. When people want to connect with you, with the human being and when you make that connection, selling is so much easier, so the more marketing you could do, the better you’ll be, but the more higher touch you have and in person is the highest touch point that you can have. Do you want to say more about that? Because I know you have more to say.

David Meltzer: Yeah, well, look, everything awareness itself is dictated by frequency or vibration. And so if you look on how we are aware of things at the highest level, when we make a connection of not just being in person but our thoughts and our words and even the truth, we can be in spirit together. And that inspiration, those thoughts that we share are the most powerful of all vibration or frequency that allows us to have a greater awareness. And what happens a lot of times is that the communication is if I reflect back on these five levels of intention, a lot of people will do everything, say everything, believe in and think it. But how do we communicate our beliefs and our feelings? And throughout history, all the great leaders will tell you it doesn’t matter what you say, it’s how they feel. And the only way that we can make the emotional connection, the energy and emotion is truly in person. And at that highest level, the highest frequency, we’re sharing our emotions, which creates an efficiency and effectiveness and statistical success and collaboration and coordination of our co-creation, which, you know, and I know is our art. Whatever we’ve co-created is truly the information, the inform in motion, the emotion tied to the form or material that we’ve created or co-created, that is our art. And in order to share it effectively, we have to, I think, be there in person to increase that statistical success and get the exponential results that we’re looking for.

Miriam Schulman: And then if you can’t be there in person, what’s the next best thing?

David Meltzer: This right here, the virtual person, because we still get the intonation, the connotation. We still can share energy by looking at one another and seeing each other. And then from there, it goes to voice. So if we can’t get this beautiful video connection that we have, then the next we can connect by voice. That’s why for years people will call their grandparents and, you know, we’re old enough in the triple chai club that all we mostly could connect with a lot of our family was by phone and voice does allow us to have a lower level of success, but yet success. And then comes writing below that as well. But that’s why I tell everyone, look, I use all four I use in person, on the phone, via email and media, traditional and social, in order to effectuate a combination or a compounding effect of every–cause individually to some people like to communicate in different ways. Even though we may be more effective in person, there’s some people that, number one, aren’t available in person, but two, they prefer to communicate by email or prefer to watch videos of you or prefer to do this virtually. So I think it’s so easy today to communicate on all the platforms that we just have to be disciplined and create behaviors that aggregate upon themselves. And just simply, Miriam, I like to tell people this all the time, and this is I do a lot of sales training outside of what you call art and just corporate enterprise sales.

Just use the numbers. If you ask one time of day in person on the phone via email and media, it’s 28 asks a month, it’s 112 asks right to 28 a week, 112 a month. Even if you have a very low percentage, 1%, you’re adding simply by asking four times, you’re adding 1.1 a month. It’s 13 sales, 13 sales a year of whatever you have at 1% closing rate. I’m going to give another–this is very powerful. I worked with Arthur Blank at Home Depot and they put the automatic machines in to check out, the automatic checkout. Compared to the contractor or the garden and the consumer checkout. They sell warranties the same way as electronic stores on appliances and other things. The aggregate of consumer, garden and contractor checkout of selling warranties. The aggregate, if you added them all up three times as many warranties were sold by the automatic checkout. Why? Because no matter what the person looked like, no matter if they were in a hurry or they’re not, the machine always asks, Do you want to buy a warranty? And it’s sold three times as many as the other checkouts. And that in itself should prove to you that you’ve got to get off your ass, as Miriam is telling you, get outside and ask for the sale. Ask for the invite.

Miriam Schulman: Yeah. There’s two things that you said that I wanted to circle back to and you kept dropping knowledge bottom after knowledge bottom. I didn’t want to interject, and that is like meeting people where they’re at. So I was working with a client and she put on her web page, ‘Oh, if you want me to meet with you to discuss the commission book, the Zoom Call’. And she was sharing with me because that’s how she feels the most comfortable, I says, Yes, but your client may not want to get on a Zoom call with you because they’re worried about what they look like, or maybe they’re shy and they don’t they don’t feel comfortable on camera. So you have to give them the option to just make a phone call, make an email. Just like you said, you have to give them the option so that they can meet you what their comfort level is, because as a salesperson, it’s about their comfort level, not always our comfort level.

And then the other thing I just wanted what you just said is what I talk about in my book, Artpreneur is belief in the buyer, which completely confirms what I say. So I call it the belief triad. We always hear people say, you have to believe in yourself, you have to believe in what you’re selling. And the third part I don’t hear too often, which is why I call it the belief tried. It’s belief in the buyer. And so what you are talking about is the machine didn’t have any limiting beliefs in the buyer. The machine just asked. And there are so many times where we don’t have belief in our buyer and we’re sabotaging ourselves because we’re thinking thoughts like, Oh, they don’t want to buy, oh, I’m being pushy. You know, you’re thinking thoughts about yourself, or you think of thoughts about your art, or you’re thinking thoughts about them and you’re getting in your own way. So I love that you shared that.

David Meltzer: Yeah. It’s so interesting how much we participate in a perception that’s working against ourselves. And one of the perceptions I also will tell you, and it’s very important in art, in your specific creations, and that’s the ability to articulate what we know when we are co-creators, when we are passionate and purposeful in love with our product, because we feel it’s part of us, it’s our baby, We fall into a trap of assumption. We assume that everybody knows everything about what we’re selling. They know the value, the capabilities, the features, the benefits, all of these things. We make an assumption because we’re so in love with our product. So I help people learn to articulate the quantitative value of what they’ve co-created, of what they’re doing and whatever that is with credibility and emotional attachment turns into the most significant way to communicate what we are offering to exceed what we’re asking for. And that’s to me, one of the biggest problems that people have is there’s so close to their own product service or solution, and so in love with their product service or solution, they have an assumption problem. They assume everyone else is without being able to articulate it to them. Why?

Miriam Schulman: Tell me more what you mean by co-creation. That was something you also asked me about on the live stream, and I really wanted to give you the platform to share your ideas on that.

David Meltzer: Well, you know, I always went through a paradigm shift in my life of being in control. And what I started to realize that instead of pursuing more happiness, more wealth, more worthiness, more of anything, that my paradigm shift through faith is that there’s an omniscient, all-powerful, all knowing source of everything for every one. I call it the law of love. And through the law of love, I believe that my primary focus should be clearing what I’m doing to interfere or co-create what already exists. And I’m a co-creation of that omniscient, all-powerful source. That’s why I’m always protected and promoted. So when I produce something, I create something. I believe I’m co-creating it because what I’ve done to create it was to inform the source of what I believe I wanted and clear the interference between me and what I believe. And I have faith that will be something bigger and better, or exactly what I want that creates this materialization or monetization in my life. And it’s a higher level of thinking. It’s a faith-based thinking and my belief of co-creation that I can’t create anything myself, that everything I do is co-created. That’s why people will laugh when they’re like, ‘Hey, he took my idea.’ Well, I’m not really sure you have any. They’re—All ideas are shared. You may have interpreted it in a different way or utilize it in a different way. So I’m a co-creator and so are you.

Miriam Schulman: Yeah. Have you studied Kabbalah? Because that’s what Kabbalah teaches.

David Meltzer: Yeah. So I’ve studied Kabbalah. I’ve studied, a course in miracles. And but Kabbalah for me was extremely transformative. And I’m a math person and a technology person. And for the first time, I felt that faith resonated with me and started to understand the universe a lot better without some of the dogmatic principles of separation that always frustrated me. My brother’s a very famous rabbi from Harvard and very opinionated in his dogmatic practices, and I’m one of curiosity and co-creation. So I questioned a lot of pragmatic disciplines from 5700 years ago that don’t seem to be as applicable for me today to stay in the oneness that I think we should stay in.

Miriam Schulman: Well, we’re not burning sheep on the altar anymore, so.

David Metzer: I doubt.

Miriam Schulman: Who’s your brother?

David Meltzer: Scott Meltzer.

Miriam Schulman: I don’t know. But I’ll look him up.

David Meltzer: Look him up.

Miriam Schulman: Being the good Jewish girl than I am.

David Meltzer: Yeah, he’s a good Jew.

Miriam Schulman: And you were not sufficiently shocked when I said I was 54, by the way.

David Meltzer: I was actually very shocked. I just—because I’m 54, I didn’t want to bring any attention to that. You look like a younger sister or even a daughter of mine. I’m like, Come on, it’s 54. [inaudible]

Miriam Schulman: Oh c’mon, your wife looks pretty hot and she’s like, in her fifties, too, right?

David Meltzer: Yeah, she’s just nine months younger than I. But yes.

Miriam Schulman: There we go. This is what 54 looks like.

David Meltzer: You guys are lucky. I personally lie to people and tell them that I’m 80 and then they’re like, Oh my gosh, you look terrific.

Miriam Schulman: You look great. as Jews, we’ve got the good—the ones who made it out of the Holocaust. We have the good genes.

David Meltzer: You’re right.

Miriam Schulman: Yeah, we survived all the different things. All right, David, it was such a pleasure to have you here. So if you want to learn more about David, first of all, check out his book Connected to Greatness. And where else should they connect with you on Instagram?

David Meltzer: And I’ll be happy to send my book to everyone. So I’ll sign it, send it and ship it to you. So email me directly. I answer them all myself. and if you forget my email. David Meltzer I’m blessed to be everywhere, so just Google my name. You will find every platform. David Meltzer is my name. Easy to find, easy to contact, happy to send. Like I said, I am here to empower others, to be happy to teach them to make a lot of money, help a lot of people and have a lot of fun. And I’ve been blessed my entire life and I love to share those blessings with you.

Miriam Schulman: Okay. And do you have any last words for our listeners before we call this podcast complete?

David Meltzer: Always be more interested than interesting. Be kind to your future self. Do good deeds.

Miriam Schulman: Love it. Thank you so much for taking the time today. I really appreciate it.

David Meltzer: Happy Birthday, Miriam and thank you for having me.

Miriam Schulman: Thank you.

We’ve included links to all these places in the show notes over at And if you’re looking for more great tips on how to market and how to raise your mindset, Go check out my book Artpreneur. It’s the number one art business book over on Amazon and whoever else comes up with these listings and we have a bunch of bonuses for you. If you go to Alright, my friend, thank you so much for being with me here today. I’ll see you, same place, same time, next week. Until then stay inspired.

Speaker 2: Thank you for listening to the Inspiration Place podcast. Connect with us on Facebook at on Instagram @schulmanart and of course, on

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